[GCFL-discuss] Soul Journey for May 29, 2004

[gcfl-discuss at gcfl.net]

Siarlys,
Wonderful response!   I think you absolutely make your point and I totally 
agree.
Layne



In a message dated 5/30/04 8:10:04 PM, gcfl-discuss at gcfl.net writes:


> On Sat, 29 May 2004 23:07:41 -0700 gcfl-discuss at gcfl.net writes:
> >SOUL JOURNEY
> 
> <<RESPONSE BELOW>>
> 
> >Ephesians 4:17-24
> 
> <<CITATION DELETED, SINCE EVERYONE HAS SEEN IT ALREADY>>
> >
> >STEALING OR BORROWING?
> 
> <<STORY DELETED, SINCE EVERYONE HAS SEEN IT ALREADY>>
> 
> >LINKS:
> >Right & Wrong: A Case For Moral Absolutes
> >http://www.discoveryseries.org/q1107/
> >
> >bottom line: New views on sin don't change God's standard.
> >
> 
> >What you propose Siarlys, is to personalizing the Bible for self
> >without recognizing God's absolute truths. That's TERRIBLY wrong!
> 
> 
> Now, whoever you are, you have failed to sign your name. As several other
> discussion participants have pointed out, that's terribly wrong.
> 
> You also fail to identify WHAT I, or anyone, have contributed to any
> discussion which is "personalizing the Bible for self without recognizing
> God's absolute truths."
> 
> But I will try, briefly, to respond anyway. God is absolute. God said "I
> am the same yesterday, today and tomorrow, I change not." I can't recall
> anything I have ever said which denies that truth.
> 
> I HAVE said that everyone must READ Scripture for themselves -- which is
> fundamental to the Protestant Reformation, even before that to Wycliffe's
> translation of the Bible into English, to the motivation for doing the
> King James translation. The Roman Catholic Church has for the past few
> centuries also recognized the value of printing the Bible in vernacular
> languages, not keeping it in Latin while the priests and the bishops tell
> people what they need to know about what is in it.
> 
> Unless you get some hedonistic pleasure out of reading the Bible, or you
> read it for purely literary interest, the purpose of reading it is not
> "for self." It is to bring your self closer to what God has in mind. As
> the modern Gospel song says "What God has for me is for me." That doesn't
> mean I am the center of the universe, it means I need to find what God
> has for me and follow it.
> 
> What I have denied is that any human authority can tell any other human
> being WHAT it is that the Bible says, or what it means. God knows, and
> God's word is true, but no bishop, no patriarch, no theologian, no priest
> or pastor, is God's representative on earth. All of the above are
> falliable human beings. They have their places and purposes, but it is
> not to beat us over the head with a Bible and say "do it my way."
> 
> This is why it is dangerous to equate moral law with the law of the
> state. It may or may not be sinful to "borrow" a fellow student's bicycle
> without permission. But if a campus, or a local court, imposes penalties,
> it is not for sinful behavior, but for violating a secular law adopted
> through some legal process by a majority of those concerned.
> 
> Thomas Aquinas wrote that the moral law will not always be the same as
> the civil law. Some moral laws have to be established by persuasion, not
> by criminal penalties. Some unacceptable behavior has to be limited by
> physical penalties, enforced through some consistent legal process.
> 
> The student who thought it OK to borrow a bicycle: the material wrong is,
> when the owner expects the bike to be there to ride across campus, it
> won't, because someone else "borrowed" it. That may be worth imposing a
> penalty for. Most of us would also agree there is a strong case for
> calling such "borrowing" a violation of the commandment "Thou shalt not
> steal." However, I personally consider reciting the Pledge of Allegiance,
> with or without the words "under God," a violation of the Second
> Commandment. Does this mean that you should be prohibited from reciting
> it?
> 
> There are absolute moral truths, but they are not simple or easy to
> learn, or to cultivate, and are not always possible for humans to
> enforce. God generally builds in automatic enforcement without the need
> for human retaliation or special miracles.
> 
> Siarlys
> 
> 

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://gcfl.net/pipermail/gcfl-discuss/attachments/20040531/80654e3f/attachment.htm