[GCFL-discuss] Fw: Re: Opening

[Discussion of the Good, Clean Funnies List]

I am paraphrasing from our classic commentary, Rashi (10th-11th Century
C.E.)
He explains it as if the verse read like this:
"whosoever slayeth Cain, .... Vengeance shall be taken on him in the seventh
[generation]."
He explains it like a parent might say to a child, "If you do such-and-such,
...." leaving the punishment to the child's imagination.

The Hebrew word "Na vaNad" is what you are translating as "a fugitive and a
vagabond ".  "Na" means always moving.  "Nad" means "exile".  ("The prefix
"Va" means "and")
Exile is the official punishment for unintentional murder.


greenBubble


-----Original Message-----
From: Discussion of the Good, Clean Funnies List
[mailto:gcfl-discuss at gcfl.net]
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 12:36 PM
Subject: Re: [GCFL-discuss] Fw: Re: Opening


Hi greenBubble,

Can you fill in a little more on the original Hebrew phrase, and its
possible meaning, compared to what I read in English translations? The
language I have easiest access to (in English, a language which did not
exist until 1400 years after the Romans destroyed the Temple) reads "I
shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to
pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me." (Gen 4:14). And the
response in v15 is "whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on
him sevenfold."

That sounds very much like he was afraid of humans. I generally am extra
cautious about taking issue with a reasonable reading of the Hebrew,
because that is the language Genesis was originally written down in. As
my Orthodox rabbi acquaintance out her points out, it is impossible to
translate from one language to another without losing some meaning that
is specific to the syntax and nuance of that language.

On the other hand, I am doubtful about the way Christians fall back on
"traditions" that are not actually in the Scriptural text, and some of
that could have happened over the course of 3000 years to even the most
orthodox Jewish belief. Take the joke about who is going to ask Jonah how
he breathed, and where. Jonah was NOT swallowed by a whale, but by a
"great fish." (Even Veggie Tales got that right, but the lady on the bus
/ little girl in science class --two different versions -- neither one
read their Bible well enough to know that.)

Of course I have my own ax to grind. I correlate recent genetic research,
indicating that our ancestors went through a genetic bottleneck (isolated
from all others closely related) wtih the last 50,000 to 200,000 years,
to the basic account of the "garden eastward in Eden" and find no
inconsistency -- because Adam was not a NAME of an INDIVIDUAL but a
generic for man -- male and female -- which "became a living soul."

Anyway, I am interested in where the animal tradition comes from, and how
it relates to the original Hebrew wording of Gen 4: 14-15. I admit, I'm
being unorthodox, but I do pay attention to original sources.

Siarlys

On Thu, 28 Jul 2005 10:45:24 -0400 "Discussion of the Good, Clean Funnies
List" <gcfl-discuss at gcfl.net> writes:
> 
>         Who was Cain afraid of when he said, "whoever sees me will 
> kill me"?
> 
> 
> According to our traditions, he was afraid of animals. G-d placed a 
> "sign"
> on him so that they shouldn't hurt him.
> 
> Again, according to our traditions, he was inadvertently killed by 
> his
> descendent Lemech. (Gen 4:24)
> 
> greenBubble
> 
> 
>
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